I might just be feeling hate-y today but..I think men are generally more base creatures. They tend to 'go with the pack' and like the hunt.

Translation - in my experience, men listen to media [read:porn] ideals of beauty a bit too much [the young ones, at least], and go for the most physically exemplary specimen.

As I said on AHG's post...I'll come back and read these when I've had some sleep and determine whether they make sense. If not I'll write it again, haha.

This is just me, but if you posted that pic and demonstrated the correct use of 'heteronormative,' that'd have been more than enough to call on you.

I always feel like looks are important to guys.  They're also important to me, so I don't know that I can say who they're more important to as far as generalizations go.

But whenever a guy I like doesn't like me back, I analyze the next girl he gets with all over to determine if she's more "conventionally attractive" than I am.  A lot of times, that answer is definitely yes.  Sometimes, I'm a little less sure.

I have one theory though, that a lot of guys have physical preferences they themselves are not even that aware of.  I say this based on the number of guys I've known who claim that looks aren't that big a deal, and then I see pictures of their exes and notice they all look pretty similar in some specific ways.  Or alternatively, they claim looks aren't that big a deal, and they date a variety of types, but the ones they fall for hardest always seem to be the most conventionally gorgeous.

There are most certainly shallow guys out there. But, I have to say, I have often found that men don't take nearly as critical an eye to women's appearances and bodies as women do to their own--and to other women's. I try to rid my mind of judgment of the way other women look and I'm really not a catty person. Even so, though, sometimes, despite myself, I'll find myself thinking something like "She looks kind of saggy in that tank top", while a guy friend will be looking at the same woman and thinking "Wow! Breasts! Cool!" It's one of the things I find appealing about men, actually.

Or at any rate, that appreciation of the female body, without nitpicking it, is a very attractive quality in a man when I do find it. A guy being nasty about other women's bodies is a huge turn-off for me. I don't like it when a man is looking to find what's wrong with a woman's appearance instead of what's right. I like men that like to feel positive about women. (That type is great in bed, too.)

That said, I think it's disingenuous for anyone, male or female, to say that they don't care at all about looks. But just because we have aesthetic appreciations, doesn't mean that that's all we care about. I also think having "types" is unavoidable. So I know exactly what you guys mean when you say that you see other women that men you've dated have dated and they're kind of creepily like you. I tend to find that amusing actually, and not necessarily a bad thing. It just is what it is. I'm probably the same way. I find myself unconsciously gravitating towards certain types of bodies etc. It's not necessarily a matter of more or less attractive though. Just different strokes for different folks.

As for porn, yeah, there are also definitely guys who are into the porn aesthetic. I think they're quite avoidable though. I probably know a lot more men that are kind of grossed out by it.

And, yes, vanity is icky! I don't even necessarily consider that a double standard. I like to look nice but I wouldn't consider myself vain; I don't spend a lot of time primping in front of the mirror or put a lot of cash into my appearance. So why would I want a guy to do those things?

Ah now I've had a teensy bit of sleep, and calmed down a little bit, I will agree with LydiaSarah. MOSTLY men aren't as critical about our appearance as we are. One one angle, take the fashion industry that tends to put forward an ideal of beauty... which sex do you think is increasingly prominent that industry these days? Women.. and when did they become prominent..about since 'thin and proportioned and blonde and buxom' was the ideal? I know its a generalization, and correlation doesn't equal causation, but it's a point for thought.

There are, however, boneheads who buy into that shit. But for the most part, men are just happy to have a woman on their arm who wants him, and lets him see her naked.

Obviously I make my initial decision to talk to a woman based on her looks.

When it comes to sex, men have a minimum criterion for the looks of a woman. If you're above it you're fuckable, if not you're not fuckable.

When it comes to relationships, character comes into play and I think an interesting personality makes looks matter less.

The choice of clothes you wear mostly matters in as they send out a signal: Do you put some thoght into what you wear? Are you wearing something inviting? How cheap do you look?