Jamie, 35
You're standing outside the "Sci-Fi Speed Dating" room. Did you participate in this event?
I wanted to, but they had a lot more men than women, and I was at the end of the line. But I saw this really hot girl in the line to go in, so I'm waiting to talk to her when she comes out.
So, I'm assuming you're single?
Yep. I'm divorced, with two kids.
How would you describe your experience of dating in the geek community?
It's awful. Miserable. Hardest thing in the world, especially at a con, or any "geekdom" event. There are tons of incredibly hot women in tight, scanty, low-cut costumes. Some are mercenaries — the "booth babes," and such. Some are actually interested in geek culture, but even those girls don't want to go out with men who are geeks.
That's funny — most of the women I've talked to at the con tell me they love geeky men.
Yeah, but most of them aren't interested in real geeks. They seem to prefer the good-looking faux-geek hipsters who might wear the occasional Star Wars T-shirt or whatever, but who can still "pass" in mainstream culture.
Have you ever hooked up with anyone you met at a con?
No. And it's not for a lack of trying. My philosophy is that you have to just go for it if you think someone's attractive. But some of the hot girls in costumes just look at you like you're some sort of perv if you actually ask them out. I can understand why — women who come to these things all dressed up must get hit on constantly. And I'm sure most of it is unwelcome, since a lot of guys who come to these things live up to the stereotype — you know, the socially awkward "basement-dwelling nerd" who plays World of Warcraft twenty hours a day.
Why not go for women other than the cos-play hotties?
It's even harder with those girls, because a lot of them are as socially awkward as the guys. Besides, the first thing you notice about someone is their looks. And I would be lying if I said I didn't care if a woman was attractive or not.
Has gaming — or any of your other hobbies — ever negatively affected your relationships?
Well, my marriage, for one! I used to play Warhammer once a week with some friends, but my ex-wife didn't like that. So I cut back to twice a month, then once a month, but it wasn't good enough. She thought gaming was frivolous and silly for a man my age. That wasn't the only reason we got divorced, but it definitely played a significant role.
What do you do for a living?
I work for a role-playing game company.
Do you ever meet any hot "gamer girls" through work?
Oh, dear God, I work with hot women! I'm surrounded by them! I used to go out with one of my coworkers, but we broke up. We're still friends, so it's fine. But all the other women are either in relationships or they refuse to date coworkers.
Since you've been single again, have you had any weird or interesting dates?
Yes! I had one epically awful date. Worst date ever. I met this woman for dinner at a quiet, upscale restaurant. She starts off by saying — very loudly — that she's a "total nymphomaniac." She tells me that she masturbates at least three times a day, and goes into elaborate detail about her various sex toys, and what she does with them. Mind you, at this point, we're, like, five minutes into the date. About half an hour in, she hadn't let up. She kind of freaked me out, so I decided to just "dine and dash." I walked out, then realized I left my coat and keys on the chair. While I was outside, she "accidentally" texted me: "This guy is cute. I may have sex with him later." When I got back to the table, she said — and this is the worst part — that she intended the text for her thirteen-year-old daughter. After dinner, she grabbed me in the parking lot and tried to force me to kiss her. I just barely squirmed out of it.
Please, tell me there wasn't a second date…
There wasn't, but she emailed the next day to ask when we were going out again. I said maybe some time in 2073.
Nicole, 25
What's your costume?
She-Ra, from He-Man.
Do you go for He-Man types?
Yes — I like muscular men in underwear! I like guys who are very manly, but they have to be smart, too. One of the guys I dated was a logger, which is pretty much my type. That or a fisherman. If a guy comes home smelling like the ocean or the outdoors — that's hot.
Sounds like you want to be a fishwife.
I probably will be a fishwife, someday! I'm a fisheries scientist, so I love men who have a connection to the ocean, whether through their work, or through science, or both. Oh, and he has to be able to fix shit, and know how to use power tools.
So, basically, you're looking for a guy with a Ph.D. who looks like he should be on a roll of paper towels.
Pretty much.
Has that been hard to find?
No, not at all. I tend to date about two guys a year.
Are you seeing anyone right now?
No. I have an on-again, off-again thing with this guy whose family has a gold mine in Nevada. But I consider myself unattached at the moment.
Do you have any dealbreakers?
If a guy is less masculine than I am. And I'm pretty masculine.
You don't look very masculine.
By that, I mean I'm strong, I can chop wood, build stuff, that sort of thing.
Have you ever hooked up with anyone you met through your work?
Sure. I always seem to meet guys when I'm out in the field doing research. Fisherman, expecially.
Did you try Sci-Fi Speed Dating here at the con?
I did. It was fun. I met some interesting people with really cool careers. A guy dressed like Batman was a molecular biologist.
Do you think you'll go out with any of the guys you met?
No. They were very nice, and interesting to talk to, but none of them were really my type. A lot of the guys seemed a little bit, you know... geeky.
At a comic convention? Get out of here.
Yeah. I don't mind if guys are into sci-fi or whatever, but they have to also be, well…
Good-looking, and able to snake your drain? Wait — that sounds much dirtier than I intended…
But you pretty much hit the nail on the head.
Alora, 21
I'm guessing you're Catwoman, but this seems a bit different from her usual get-up.
Yeah, usually she wears outfits that cover her arms and chest. I like to modify my costumes to show more cleavage, even if it's not entirely authentic to the character. The thing is, in real life, I don't normally dress very outrageously. That's part of the fun — it's not me, it's the character who dresses like this.
Have you ever hooked up with anyone you met at a con?
No, never. It would be a terrible place to meet someone. You're not yourself when you're dressed up — you're a persona. It's fun to be someone else for a day — Catwoman, or Rogue from X-Men, or whatever. But it's not me.
Is there a Mr. Catwoman in your life?
You could say that. I've been with my boyfriend for about a year and a half.
Does he mind that you like to dress up in sexy outfits and go to conventions?
Not at all! He loves it. We go to a lot of costume parties, and he likes me to dress up, so he can show me off.
Is your boyfriend also a geek?
Actually, he's more of a nerd than a geek.
What's the difference?
Everyone has different definitions, but he's very into tech, computer stuff, video games, that kind of thing. I'm more of a geek — into comic books, fantasy, sci-fi. There's a lot of overlap in nerd and geek culture, but I think it's mostly defined by having a passion for something that isn't necessarily in the mainstream. For instance, I may not share my boyfriend's interest in, say, programming, but I get how passionate he can be about technology. And he may not love all the same shows or comics or games that I like, but he understands what it's like to have a consuming interest in something.
How did you meet your boyfriend?
I'm in a gaming group, and he was a friend of a friend. So we sort of met through the whole "geek community."
What do you do for a living?
I'm a full-time student, studying archaeology.
Before meeting your boyfriend, did you date a lot of different guys?
No. Almost none. You could say this is my first "real" relationship. I really don't get out much. I tend to hang out with a small group of friends, which is great, but you don't meet a lot of new people that way.
What first attracted you to your boyfriend?
Other than his beautiful blue eyes, probably his confidence. I love confident guys. A lot of geeky guys are shy and awkward, and that makes it hard to have a conversation, much less a relationship with them. I think I'm more compatible with nerds than geeks. And a lot of nerds are very confident — sometimes overly-confident. Oh, and he has a great sense of humor. Some geeks take themselves too seriously, and I can't stand that.
Want to talk to strangers in your town? Email submissions@nerve.com.
Commentarium (33 Comments)
NEEEEERRRRRRRDDDDDDSSSSSSSS
Hate to correct you, but technically they're geeks, not nerds.
Um, is it just me or is Jamie SUPER creepy?
So he pretty much constantly approaches hot women. And he makes up dates with nymphos.
OOOOOOOOk.
I totally agree! When he mentioned that he can't lie that he's a woman's attractiveness is important to him, I thought about how uninterested in him all those attractive women must be.
Yes, how DARE a guy who looks like him want to hook up with someone to whom he's strongly attracted! Doesn't he know he's in the "take-what-you-can-get" class? Doesn't he understand that any overture he makes to an attractive woman is creepy, by definition, because of the way he looks? Doesn't he know his PLACE, for God's sake?!
Seriously, y'all are both douches. He never says anything about being entitled to a beautiful woman, resentful of them, or anything of the sort; he simply expresses the desire to get romantically involved with someone he considers very attractive. (Isn't that what we all want?) And he follows the advice that everyone's always handing out to men: if you're confident and approach a woman you're interested in, the worst thing that can happen is that she'll say no. But of course, he's supposed to know that that advice is only for "hot" guys.
I mean, look at the next interviewee. I don't think she's especially good-looking or appealing, and yet she has very high standards (a "muscular" guy "with a Ph.D. who looks like he should be on a roll of paper towels") and says she has zero interest in any of the guys at the con because they're not good-looking enough and are too geeky. Why is it OK for her to think she deserves the best, but not OK for Jamie to say he wants someone "attractive" (he doesn't say a perfect 10 or anything like that)?
As for the claim that his story's a fake, whatever. I've seen some weird and unbelievable shit in my years of dating, and it's taught me that truth is usually stranger than fiction. Nothing else in his comments is self-aggrandizing, so I have no reason to doubt his story any more than the other yarns that always get spun as part of this feature.
Hey AAC,
I think my real complaint with him is that he seems to have a double standard. Like he criticizes women for not being interested in him and preferring "good-looking" guys. Yet, he also seems to be only interested in "incredibly hot women in tight, scanty, low-cut costumes." I just find it interesting that he doesn't seem to see the problem there.
Also, I kind of think Jamie is pretty hot, but I suppose I could see why you might think she is shallow for her taste in men.
And I'm not douche, thanks!
That's not really what he criticizes them for, though. His beef is more that though they claim to be "geek girls", when it comes down to it, they generally date good-looking poseurs who casually co-opt a watered-down version of geek culture for its social cachet. And that's a legitimate beef: if you say you love something, but the people you date embody a piss-poor version of that thing, then maybe you're a poseur too. It's like saying you love jazz and that jazz is a huge part of your life, but then dating someone drop-dead gorgeous whose favorite record is Kenny G. It suggests that you're a dilettante, dishonest, or just thinking with your genitals.
And he doesn't really say that he's only interested in "incredibly hot women in tight, scanty, low-cut costumes." He says he's surrounded by "hot" women, which -- given that he works at a role-playing game company -- probably doesn't mean that they're all models and cosplay pinups. Most of us hope to date someone we consider "hot", after all; relationships where we think the other person is passable don't usually have great sexual chemistry.
I don't think Nicole is hot (at all), but I don't begrudge her preferences. I just hate the narrative that women's shallow preferences are empowering and justified, and men's shallow preferences are oppressive and creepy.
Sorry for calling you a douche, but I just thought people were way too harsh on this guy because he's overweight, approaching middle-aged, and male. If he'd said the same things and been young and good-looking, or a female of any sort, no one would've blinked.
Women are bombarded by mainstream media images of very attractive women with much less attractive men on a regular basis. Just a few: Seth Rogen in "Knocked Up," Paul Giamatti and Virginia Madsen in "Sideways," Woody Allen in any movie he's paired with a female. Kevin James in "King of Queens" and his wife Leah Remini , Jim Belushi paired with Courtney Thorne-Smith...and these just off the top of my head.
Let me tell you me beef, AAC. They are no media images where there's an equivalent hot guy, much less attractive female that easily come to mind as the above do.
Women are tired of this one sided story of male shallowness, while we're supposed to be "above" caring about a guy's looks.
I'm not a proponent of people, of either gender, being shallow though I understand that everyone wants to feel attracted to their partner. But unless you're really shallow, they don't have to be really hot in order to be attractive.
You may think people are being too harsh about this one man, but to a lot of women he's perpetuating this inequity.
+1 AAC
He seems like a nice, honest dude. Especially compared to these other douchetards.
+1 to Nope, that about sums it up.
+1 to Nope
Thanks for articulating this viewpoint so well!
@Nope: Unpacking those tropes of cinema and TV are beyond the scope of what I can discuss in a comment. But the problem with your claim of injustice is that it doesn't acknowledge the huge asymmetry in male-female attraction, i.e. the fact that most women are strongly attracted to POWER. One reason why we see so many images of schlubby men and beautiful women is because that's how it often plays out in real life, as any trip to a large city's financial district will tell you in a heartbeat. As Henry Kissinger famously said, "Power is the ultimate aphrodisiac," and whether that power manifests itself through one's physical prowess, bankbook, or political influence, it's incredibly magnetic to a pretty large number of women, who are willing to practically ignore a man's appearance if he's powerful enough (just as many men will ignore a woman's vacuousness if she's physically attractive enough). And that preference is not symmetrical, and giveth not the tiniest of shits whether it's "fair" to men or women.
Now, we have two choices. One is to pat ourselves on the back and say that women's attraction to power and dominance is as contemptible and shitty as men's attraction to big breasts, symmetrical faces and narrow waists. The other is to say "Live and let live", accept that there's something in these preferences that has something like a rational basis, and allow people to continue their quest to find someone who has both superficial appeal and deep substance.
But what I don't find acceptable is the idea that one of the sexes has all the culpability here, because that's just not true. In other words, if we're unleashing the hounds on someone like Jamie -- who, when it comes down to it, simply hopes to find someone he thinks is "attractive" -- then let's also unleash them the next time a woman in one of these features says that she prefers dating "ambitious" or "manly" men. Let's interrogate the female attraction to power, confidence, and dominance as aggressively as we interrogate the male attraction to youth, physical beauty, and sexual availability. But somehow I'm guessing that's not gonna happen.
I don't have time right now, unfortunately, to go into a long deconstruction of what you've just said, AAC. So I'll oversimplify it and say I do agree with you about power and (some) women. And nope, I don't think a woman who's into a man only for his bank account (read power) is any better than a man who's into a woman for only how she looks.
I do see in your last post that you've neatly sidestepped the point I made above, however, and so I'll reiterate it. There is no "power equivalency" in the media portrayals I mentioned above, Kevin James' character is a UPS guy, Seth Rogen's character in Knocked Up is not at all successful, nor is Paul Giamatti's character in Sideways, etc. They are average, and even below-average, Joes in every way in terms of "success" and "power" and "confidence."
In every day life we absolutely see rich and therefore powerful men with women much more attractive than themselves...and I'd posit that we also see the same in same-sex relationships, older wealthy gay men with younger, attractive gay men, and that not-as-attractive women straight or not, who are rich can get more attractive partners. So what you're talking about in terms of power equivalencies is not just exclusive to gender. But the idea that a schlubby, not wealthy or traditionally successful man should not only be able to, but has a right to a hot woman b/c he's sweet and lovable, is marketed aggressively ONLY to straight women.
The fact is that I'm not at all against this idea. To get personal for a moment, I've had several boyfriends that it's gotten back to me that others don't consider "in my league." I'm considered very attractive, for better or worse, in our culture. But anyone who knows me well will tell you that looks, money don't matter much to me. I care about kindness, wit and brains.
That said, I think people of both sexes can be very shallow. My point is that the idea that one shouldn't be shallow and should value other qualities above looks is marketed aggressively to only straight women in our culture, not straight men.
And that, in a nutshell, is my problem. I don't care that "it shouldn't be all about shallow valuations" is marketed to women, I'd just like to see it as aggressively marketed to me. That's it.
Last sentence should read, " don't care that "it shouldn't be all about shallow valuations" is marketed to women, I'd just like to see it as aggressively marketed to MEN. That's it." Sorry about the typo.
Rissy, either your story about your ex is brilliantly invented... or he's a brilliant maniac :-) . Since you seem witty and since you are beautiful, I think he's a maniac.
I dig Rafael-- I would never get emotionally involved with him--I believe him when he says he's an asshole-- but I would have so much fun yelling at him, "You're a dick!" and then falling over laughing. Then we'd go get drunk and dominate at beer pong. Then I wouldn't see him for 6 months or a year, and because I wasn't worn out by his shenanigans, I'd be glad to see him again.
Scott: "One Christmas, my cousin got a stuffed giraffe, and he looked closely and realized it was also a vibrator."
Why did you only ask the shy boy about kink? You should have asked the pretty girls!
Jamie reinforces all sorts of negative stereotypes about geeks and/or nerds, whatever nomenclature you prefer. I don't like him and I don't like his assertions regarding women and their desire for faux-nerds.
This was my favorite one of these segments in a long time. I like that it wasn't just the usual questions.
Interesting bunch. Scott....man, dude's got a family with no sense of boundaries. Being flogged while family is around? Odd.
Maybe Rachel Dratch should go on a date with Rafael? He's right that women love assholes, no matter how much theybitch and moan about them. The problem is, it's hard to figure out how to be one if you're not one.
I have confidence in your ability to be an asshole.
Step 1: get into the type of shape that a personal trainer is in
Step 2: realize that if you're hot enough, people will sleep with you even if they dislike you
step 3: profit!
I am curious about Rizzy's boyfriend being an multiple amputee...which limbs and why?
Plus, she is fooking gorgeous
I'm pretty sure she threw that in as a joke...
That would be a weird thing to joke about. Lots of people have amputations--or other physical handicaps--*and* good sex/love lives.
So basically, a comic con is a place where women dress up in slutty superhero outfits and cocktease a bunch of lonely male geeks who are already sexually frustrated?
Get me some spandex, I'm in.
"Yeah, but most of them aren't interested in real geeks. They seem to prefer the good-looking faux-geek hipsters who might wear the occasional Star Wars T-shirt or whatever, but who can still "pass" in mainstream culture."
"Besides, the first thing you notice about someone is their looks. And I would be lying if I said I didn't care if a woman was attractive or not."
Well Jamie, looks like the women are doing the same thing you're doing. Goose, gander, all that noise.
if you're gonna go dressed as scott pilgrim, at least know he has seven evil exes, not six
the seventh one was nega-scott
So "strong, can chop wood and build stuff" is somehow inherently masculine? And, therefore, presumably not feminine?
Well, that's bollocks. Women who are strong, can chop wood and build stuff are my kind of feminine!
Cheers to strong women who don't buy into all that 'masculine = strong and practical' crap.
Snake. Your. Drain.
Gonna use that in the pub tonight.
Okay this one was brilliant. What better setting for a TTS column! And I'm in love with the first girl!